| Author | Message | ||
Okahyderabadi Side Hero Username: Okahyderabadi Post Number: 7264 Registered: 12-2009 Posted From: 198.50.153.61 Rating: N/A |
Yes I keep following the defence forums very actively and there are many details shared there that many of us are not even aware of. There are very detailed threads on why and what of each type of equipment from defence experts and in some cases active and recently retired servicemen. comparisions between our equipment vs the chinks and pakis etc are carried out as are the details about various technologies under development in India for various branches. In history there is no such thing as the last word on any subject research leads to new things every day | ||
Pavala Megastar Username: Pavala Post Number: 28358 Registered: 02-2008 Posted From: 2.104.12.50 Rating: |
Amarvati expenses Bob cheppadam ledhu...Bob ni scamster andhaamaa? Mahesh performance lo 10% kooda Chiru cheyyaledu.... - New_user Spyder - Critically acclaimed disaster - New_user | ||
Siloan Legend Username: Siloan Post Number: 53352 Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 132.174.20.41 Rating: |
andhra kooda bhaaraddesh lo bagame ga..which makes him desh ki gauddar | ||
Rajusk Legend Username: Rajusk Post Number: 61129 Registered: 02-2008 Posted From: 170.74.248.21 Rating: N/A |
ippudu clarity gaa undi do festival  | ||
Whyme Megastar Username: Whyme Post Number: 24221 Registered: 09-2009 Posted From: 171.161.160.10 Rating: N/A |
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Siloan Legend Username: Siloan Post Number: 53351 Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 132.174.20.41 Rating: N/A |
baraaabar antaam raju goru ...desh ki gaddaar....andhra deshhh | ||
Onlytruth Legend Username: Onlytruth Post Number: 199681 Registered: 01-2007 Posted From: 107.77.111.130 Rating: N/A |
osmania joke  | ||
Author Side Hero Username: Author Post Number: 9179 Registered: 12-2010 Posted From: 77.243.183.82 Rating: N/A |
dorikesada!! chass..inka Modi juttu TTs chetilo na!! | ||
Rajusk Legend Username: Rajusk Post Number: 61128 Registered: 02-2008 Posted From: 170.74.248.21 Rating: N/A |
nice post bro..chaala detailed gaa icharu saar vaadu..as to how things happen.. i had a friend who was a Bofors operational expert..back in the day..so political interference etc gurrinchi cheppevaadu..good that they also have an outlet to vent out and provide details.. of course comprehension issues unte story ardham kaadu....kiki | ||
Rajusk Legend Username: Rajusk Post Number: 61127 Registered: 02-2008 Posted From: 170.74.248.21 Rating: N/A |
meaning telisi postandi rao garu.. synma title gaa baaguntundi ani ikkada postithe antha baagundadu.. | ||
Stalker Side Hero Username: Stalker Post Number: 4087 Registered: 08-2012 Posted From: 12.252.19.134 Rating: N/A |
Bofors reopen chestunnaru ani ee rahul bokesh rechuthunattu unnadu..sollu gaadu Stalker - 'S'traight talker | ||
Siloan Legend Username: Siloan Post Number: 53350 Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 132.174.20.41 Rating: |
desh ki gaddar | ||
Ringo_rangaswamy Hero Username: Ringo_rangaswamy Post Number: 18515 Registered: 02-2011 Posted From: 8.36.66.4 Rating: N/A |
Yemi leni panche yegiregiri padutundi... Pedda moota panche saddukuni kookuntundi... | ||
Onlytruth Legend Username: Onlytruth Post Number: 199675 Registered: 01-2007 Posted From: 107.77.89.25 Rating: |
Rafael jet scamster Modi | ||
Okahyderabadi Side Hero Username: Okahyderabadi Post Number: 7263 Registered: 12-2009 Posted From: 198.50.153.61 Rating: |
Meeku time opika unte go through the threads in defence forums giving one hre https://forums.bharat-rakshak.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=7266&h ilit=Rafale+deal#p2058958 exceprt from an Airmarshal A Dose of Realism - The Rafale purchase controversy https://www.telegraphindia.com/opinion/ ... ism-196447 By Air Marshal Brijesh D. Jayal (Retd) - 27 Dec 2017 There is something about the procurement of military equipment from western commercial sources that generates public interest far greater than its financial or strategic content. The entire spectacle of open tendering, nail-biting selection, followed by endless negotiations - all played out in the public domain - does little justice to the very serious business of dealing with a weapon system for the battlefield which, in reality, should remain strictly confidential, if not totally secret. In rare cases of contracts approaching fruition, chances are that at some politically opportune time, they would also become the subject of political controversy with scarcely any concern about the adverse impact this will have on national security, the operational capability of the armed forces or, indeed, on their morale. The latest to join this league is the truncated MMRCA purchase of 36 Rafale aircraft from Dassault Aviation against the Indian air force's requirement of 126 aircraft, a process that was initiated in 2007 as a commercial bid, but remained deadlocked till a new government took charge, scrapped it, and took a decision to go by the government-to-government route. Political opponents have now fired a salvo, alleging that the final contracted unit cost per aircraft was far greater than the one that had been negotiated by the previous government and that due procedures laid down had been violated. This, in turn, has generated a freewheeling public debate - much of it based on limited technical knowledge and perception rather than on hard facts. As someone who has spent nearly a decade in Air HQ in the planning and procurement branch in various capacities, including its head as deputy chief of air staff, was part of the ministry of defence team that negotiated the Anglo-French Jaguar contract in the late 1970s (which, at the time, had more than its share of speculative media debate and corruption criticisms), observed at close range how the United Kingdom and the French military aerospace industries function and been a part of numerous MoD negotiating teams thereafter, one feels morally bound to inject some realism in this self-defeating debate. This is because whatever may be the political or moral compulsions driving it, at its very least it undermines the confidence that the IAF rank and file will have in its own military leadership and adversely affect morale. That is why the IAF chief has been constrained to take the unusual step of publicly stressing that it was a government-to-government contract, and that it was a better deal with lower cost implications than the earlier MMRCA contract negotiations. Even in commercial contracts that relate to modern combat aircraft and associated weapons and systems, national governments and strategic security interests of both seller and buyer countries are invariably involved. National governments of aerospace suppliers hence keep a benign check on their own industries - to promote their international sales footprint - as also on their industrial practices to prevent diplomatic embarrassment. All suppliers also require that their costs are treated as 'commercially confident' information for the buyer only. In the event of such contracts being backed through a government-to-government understanding,these commitments take on a more formal role. Unlike many stand-alone products, it is too simplistic a notion to calculate costs per aircraft, because without ground and test equipment, weapons, spares support, repair facilities and a host of other essentials, the aircraft has no utility as an operational weapon system . Any cost comparisons to be meaningful must hence be based on the total system cost on a like-to-like basis. If a realistic analysis were to be attempted comparing the earlier MMRCA proposal and the truncated renegotiated one, this would need a detailed cost-benefit analysis by a body of specialists, who, in the end, would still be left guessing about many subjective issues that have significant value in the operational domain but are not readily quantifiable in financial terms. In this context, two examples merit mention, although there would be many more. According to Nitin A. Gokhale's book, Securing India the Modi Way: Pathankot, Surgical Strikes and More, Dassault Aviation is now contractually committed to provide performance-based logistic support for five years to two squadrons against the earlier proposal to support only one squadron. Further, it is committed to ensuring that a minimum of 75 per cent of the IAF fleet will always be available for operations. These contractual commitments are a major advantage and, to one's knowledge, have never been undertaken by any earlier supplier to the IAF, including the Hindustan Aeronautics Limited. For those looking for juicy headlines, these may be mundane issues, but for a combat force these have tremendous operational and support value and cannot be quantified in monetary terms. To reduce this debate to higher unit costs being paid without weighing in the operational returns not only exposes our hollow understanding of operational imperatives but is also an unfortunate political red herring that needs a swift burial. This brings us to the issue of due procedures not being followed. The Bofors scandal has resulted in a defence procurement eco- system within the South Block where procrastination has became the norm. Few in the decision-making chain would venture to take decisions for fear of falling prey to allegations of wrongdoing. The bureaucratic shield for this is hence the defence procurement procedure, first issued in 2002 and now in its ninth edition. Rather than using this as a procedural guide, it is being treated as a policy cast in stone. In the complex world of defence trade, lack of flexibility on the part of those negotiating purchases is a sure recipe for stalling any acquisition proposal as there are innumerable variables. This explains why our armed forces are hopelessly behind in executing modernization plans. Two fundamental errors were made by MoD while issuing the initial tender. First, the bidder was expected to take ownership for the 108 aircraft to be produced by HAL, a demand that is patently impractical. Second, competitive commercial bids were evaluated on the basis of production man-hours as indicated by bidders in their respective production environments without applying any multiplication factor in case of HAL manufacture (a factor that was even applied to earlier licence programmes like the Jaguar). In the event this was determined by HAL as 2.7 times and would have upset calculations that had led to the initial choice of the lowest bidder. Instead of recognizing these lapses and making amends in a transparent way through policy intervention, the MoD let procedure prevail over operational imperative. To quote from Gokhale's book, "Parrikar told Modi it would be legally untenable to go through with the MMRCA contract since the process had been completely vitiated thanks to Antony's indecisiveness and a crucial oversight in the original terms of the contract." The one exception to the Bofors syndrome thus far has been that at least it did not hamper government-to-government procurement contracts. This would explain how, since 1987, the armed forces have managed to retain some semblance of preparedness. It would now appear that even this last avenue for modernization is being targeted by an attack on this government-to-government Rafale programme. We have a constitutional authority, the comptroller and auditor general of India, to look into the integrity of defence purchases. Having been at the receiving end of its audit of the Jaguar procurement decades ago, this writer can vouch for its thoroughness and professionalism. People's representatives would be fully justified in asking for a CAG audit if there are genuine doubts. But by raising this on the electoral battlefield, we have ended up compromising the cause of the real one. Indian democracy should be made of sterner stuff. -------------------------------------bottom line -------------------------- congress leaders dont know jack about defence and have continously delayed projects or procurements leaving all the three defence wings of India in dire straights. Modi govt has put everything on fast track and is providing all the required support to them. Once sector where we cannot find fault with Modi govt is defence needs. In history there is no such thing as the last word on any subject research leads to new things every day | ||
Jaguar Comedian Username: Jaguar Post Number: 1153 Registered: 01-2017 Posted From: 12.180.115.102 Rating: |
shameless SCAMSTER BODI... | ||
Andhrawala Legend Username: Andhrawala Post Number: 65959 Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 152.51.56.1 Rating: N/A |
Congress is synonym for Corruption. Even Raul knows that as his Dad Rajiv Gandhi lost power becos of Bofors scam. No Signature | ||
Okahyderabadi Side Hero Username: Okahyderabadi Post Number: 7261 Registered: 12-2009 Posted From: 198.50.153.61 Rating: N/A |
Raul ki emi teliyadu, defence forums loki velli chooste telustadi Congress vedhavalu defence ni enta brashtu pattincharu and what is the state of our preparedness under them anedi. Otti sollu vadidi In history there is no such thing as the last word on any subject research leads to new things every day | ||
Andhrawala Legend Username: Andhrawala Post Number: 65958 Registered: 03-2008 Posted From: 152.51.56.1 Rating: N/A |
In a direct attack on Prime Minister Narendra Modi in the multi-crore Rafale jet deal, Congress president Rahul Gandhi today said that the PM had personally gone to Paris to get the deal signed, and that he is behind the scam. Talking to reporters, Rahul said, "The Defence Minister says that we will not reveal the amount paid for buying Rafale aircrafts. What does this mean? This only means there is a scam. Modiji personally went to Paris, he changed the deal. The whole country knows it." Meanwhile, the Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP) has refuted Rahul Gandhi's claim. "Who will inform the poorly read Office of Rahul Gandhi who has no issues compromising national security at the altar of politics," BJP IT-cell head, Amit Malviya, said in a tweet. Shortly before his big attack on Modi, the 47-year-old leader had also tweeted: "Top Secret (Not for Distribution). RM (Defence Minister) says the price negotiated for each RAFALE jet by the PM and his "reliable" buddy is a state secret. Action Points 1. Informing Parliament about the price is a national security threat 2. Brand all who ask, Anti-National." The hashtag with Rahul Gandhi's tweet called the deal with France to buy 36 fighter jets #TheGreatRafaleMystery. On Monday, Defence Minister Nirmala Sitharaman had told Parliament that the details of the deal with France for the Rafale fighter jets cannot be disclosed since the Inter-Governmental Agreement makes it "classified information". "As per Article 10 of the Inter-Governmental Agreement between Governments of India and France on the purchase of Rafale aircraft, the protection of the classified information and material exchanged under IGA is governed by the provisions of the Security Agreement signed between Government of France and Government of India in 2008," she said. The Congress has alleged that there are irregularities in the deal for buying 36 Rafale fighter jets off-shelf from France, claiming that they were being bought at a price higher than negotiated in the previous multi-role combat aircraft (MMRCA) deal under which 126 fighter jets were to be bought, and included a number of fighters being assembled in India. Earlier today, Congress Leader of Opposition in Rajya Sabha, Ghulam Nabi Azad, asked why the Modi government decided to buy 36 instead of the original plan to buy 126 Rafale jets from France. "Why did the government decide to buy 36 and not 126 jets? This decision was taken without the approval of the Cabinet Committee for Security. What is the cost of each Rafale jet? When we entered the deal, each jet cost Rs 526 crore. Why is this Rs 1517 crore today?" Azad asked. However, this is not the first time that secrecy clause has been sought by a defense minister in Parliament. In 2013, replying to a question raised by Venkaiah Naidu on the AgustaWestland scam, the then defense minister AK Antony sought the secrecy clause under Italian law to state that no concrete information regarding the preliminary investigation was available with the ministry. In 2004, the then defense minister George Fernandes, while replying to a question on purchase of Mirage II aircrafts, cited the secrecy condition of the clause and replied, "Secrecy condition of the contract prohibits disclosure of the price." WHAT IS THE RAFALE JET DEAL WITH FRANCE? In order to replace the existing MiG-21 aircraft, a case to procure 126 Mirage-2000 aircraft was initiated in the year 2000, which was later converted to procurement of 126 MMRCAs. A Request For Proposal (RFP) was issued in 2007, wherein six vendors had responded. On completion of Field Evaluation Trials, only two out of the six vendors were found to be fully compliant. Commercial proposals of both vendors EADS and Dassault Aviation were opened and negotiations were commenced with Dassault as the L1 vendor in November 2011. The RFP was formally withdrawn on June 24, 2015. India and France signed the inter-government agreement for buying 36 Rafale fighters, off the shelf, on September 23, 2016, following long negotiations on the deal, agreed upon during Prime Minister Narendra Modi's visit to France in April 2015. No Signature |
